K & N Filters

Okay so we have heard the good and bad side of intake mods and various other performance mods.

So my question is if these intakes are so bad why are so many companies making them and how are they staying in business?

Also, I have heard a lot about the negatives of more air but some of you guys posting said you had TB spacers, isn't the purpose of that more air? and what about larger throttle bodies isn't that for more, I have heard nothing but good about a 4.0L TB swap on a 2.5L, in fact I have done it with minor yet positive results, so what gives?

And beyond the air arguments are there any good return on investment bolt on engine performance mods, beside the high dollar turbo and supercharger type?

Does anyone want to argue that an intake, bored throttle body, header and exhaust won't give noticeable power gains, if tend to think there has to be some positive effect to this combonation of mods?

What about a chip upgrade? Upgraded coil? Fat spark plug wires? Is it all garbage?

Alot of the popularity of these simple bolt-on HP mods has to do with what is commonly called the free lunch syndrome. Most people look at it as damn if I spend $35.00 on a filter I could get 10HP, if I get a free flow exhaust then I am looking at 20 hp. Mind you these are advertised #'s and 95% of teh public who own vehciles who do simple mods are just looking at advertisements. Everyone wants cheap horsepower gains for cheap but if you look at what you actually get you are extememly dissapointed. Somewhere on JU was a great study done by someone to figure out what the actual difference in HP/dollar you had by simple bolt ons and a supercharger. FIgure a supercharger gets you 125 HP and they cost $3500.00 then look at all the bolts ons you can do to get at most (this is a dyno actual real world figure)15 HP with a FIPK, chip, bored out tb, tb spacer, header freeflow cat, free flow muffler. you come to a total of $1700.00 sooooo you are looking at $113.00 for every 1 HP gained vs $28.00/HP gained with a super charger. SOooo you are seemingly not oulaying much for these gains but in truth they are actually costing you 4x's more per horsepower vs. an induction system. Henc the term no free lunch

Quote from "turtle"

You are talking about purpose built mud rigs that have everything else sealed for use in very deep water

Well yeah. I was assuming that people who go to the trouble putting a snorkel on would also go to the trouble of sealing everything else up as well.

Were you guys just talking about ONLY putting on a snorkel and doing NOTHING to the distributor and wires to keep them dry? If that is the case then I agree. The snorkel alone is just a straw for your engine to breathe through.

Quote

Short answer is NO. When you light the dynamite, Which will give you a bigger bang, a match or blow torch? Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

Did you me short answer is Yes, or are you just being sarcastic all around with that last one? I mean match or blow torch both are gonna light the fuse and give the same bang........right?

So would you say quality parts as opposed to "replacement" or "upgrade" parts are a good investment to gain the most efficient performance? (i.e. Optima Battery, Accel or MSD coil and wires, Name Brand Spark Plugs and Oil)

Or do you believe stay stock and stick to a strict maintenance regimen for the best performance?

Ohh I definitely need to regear I am just intrigued by this topic. I have always believed that there was some positive noticeable gain to bolt on engine performance mods. I'm not saying they will make my Jeep feel like I have a V8 or that will double the HP or even increase it by 50%. But underDAWG seems to think that it is all a waste and I want to know what he thinks is worthwhile.

If the answer is nothing unless you want to do an engine swap or buy an expensive supercharger then I can accept his opinion but I just find it hard to believe with all the performance parts out there and how huge the industry is that everyone is getting the wool pulled over their eyes. I mean this is the first time I have heard someone completely refute or denounce all bolt on performance parts. I would have thought I would have read more negative test reviews upgrades like intakes and exhausts or a combination of both. In actuality it seems that most are overwhelmingly positive or at least mildly positive when it comes to bolt on upgrades.

Ohh well maybe I am just as naive as the rest the consumers buying a reviewing these parts.

I tend to agree with Linyee on the majority of bolt on garb. Regardless if there are minor gains here or there. Put you money where it makes a real difference. Gears lockers, tires, safe and proper lifts. It is a bling enabled world, better to know your own mind then to follow. (You never know who they are following. )

Now, MSD, HEI or FTI ignition upgrades do make a difference in most cases. Older jeeps especially where the factory spark was inadequate and less reliable than more modern ignition systems. No one can argue that replacing a Carter carb with a motorcraft or a Weber wont give significant performance and reliability gains. No one can argue that a FI conversion doesn't beat a carb.

It's your money, you earned it, spend it as you wish. IMHO, you do have a responsibility to use your use what you have in a way that has value. Remember those who have nothing when buy something $$$ that really wont make a real difference. Is it to impress? I think thats why so many people dont regear or lock. No one can see it. You don't get any attention.

Steve (Admits to having a K&N on his Weber, but to his defense he bought it bundled with the carb)

Right on thanks for the input, I just really like hearing peoples opinions and I appreciate yours. Experience speaks volumes over speculation and I only have a few years of experience so anything I can gather from others is greatly appreciated.

A couple final questions.....

-What is Dino oil?
-I heard it is bad to switch to a synthetic oil in a higher mileage vehicle because the detergents can pull deposits off the inside of the engine causing excess wear, is this true?
-I have always thought regular changes (3000 miles) of conventional motor oil was cheap insurance, is this excessive?
-I run Champion truck plugs and change them about once a year, I change my cap and rotor every year or two as well unless I have a problem, how often should I replace my spark plug wires?
-And finally, do you think a drop in K&N air filter is bad like an open cone K&N or will it work just the same as a paper replacement?

Quote from "rafartist"

From my personal experience, I noticed a gain with an exhaust, TB, and an AEM system, plain and simple. The 4.0's are inefficient and more air will help the mix to burn better. And for only gaining at high rpm, thats wrong, I drive around 2300 rpm on the highway and got an increase in mileage and pulling power up hills.

A friend of mine's father once told me that the best thing you can do for an inline 6 is make it breather better. As was said a few pages back (think it was Turtle), you have to improve the exhaust flow as well as the intake flow. I'm not sure WHY inline 6s are bad breathers but I just know to listen to his father when he speaks because he is usually right.